Tuesday 24 May 2011

I seem to have lost my Hive Mind

I seem to have lost my Hive Mind

I found this criticism of Quranists on a forum

Perfection is perceived subjectively unless defined and explained by a similar perfection that comprehends it in all it’s perfection. The interpretation of the perfection is corrupted by an imperfect perspective. Thus the preservation is intact only within the scripture itself, but the perception is corruptible. This is clear because ‘Qur’anists’ ‘sect’ individually contradict each other on the interpretations of the verses. This conflict and proof that though the perfectness is indeed preserved, and we know its preserved, the perception however is imperfect unless that perception is originated too by perfectness.

To demonstrate this:

Get 1000 ‘qur’anist’ idiots.

Place the idiots in 1000 separate rooms, each with their own copy of the qur’an.

Ask each idiot to write the interpretation of each verse, e.g. how they derive laws that they must follow.

Grab each of their writings, and compare them.

They will differ.


The Qur’an remains perfectly preserved. The perception remains perfectly imperfect. The qur’anists remain perfectly retarded.

I don’t understand why it’s a problem that 1000 people don’t have a hive mind. We are not the Borg.

Read more at quranistvoices.wordpress.com

Monday 23 May 2011

Jumping to conclusions

Jumping to conclusions

“What a cult. You follow a person who called himself a prophet of god-Rashad Khalifa. He created this stupidity of hadith being rejected. Good thing he was assasinated. And now he’s burning in hell. I suggest you all comback to the ONE TRUE REAL Islam. Unfortunately Satan has gotten to you all. Remember Rashad Khalifa was an idiot moron. Follow Muhammed pbuh.”

My response :

“Quranists believe that the Quran is the sole source of divine guidance as opposed to there being any 2nd or 3rd sources. This term is not to be confused with following the teachings of Rashad Khalifa. Rashad Khalifa claimed to be a messenger and rejected 2 verses of the Quran, presented a “miracle code” using the number 19 and his teachings (it seems to me) usually accuse the ones who do not agree with his approach as disbelievers or polytheists. In my honest opinion, his translation is also biased to fit his beliefs, and the translation of the Arabic to English is not consistent within itself (as is the case with most translations, unfortunately). 
Quranists on the other hand do not reject 2 verses and have a more inclusive attitude which does not seek to label other approaches to islam as wrong, heretical or blasphemous. They will also usually endeavour to investigate the original Arabic words in the Quran and the context of the verses, chapters, examples and parables to strengthen their own personal understanding of the text. Please also see “A Quranists response to the term ‘Hadith Rejection‘ ” for more info. 
Furthermore Quranists believe that we are to take examples from the Prophets as described in the Quranic stories. A fantastic article about the “Prophetic Examples from the Quran” can be found here, which discusses the premise that “the only thing containing the example of the Prophet is the Quran itself”. “
Read more at quranistvoices.wordpress.com

Definition of a Sect

Definition of a Sect

I do believe there is a difference between what a sect is defined as in English and what the “arabic word that is translated as sect” is from the Quran. I think the most important thing is to find out what the Quran says.
There are enough verses in the Qur’an which justify making choices (judging) according to what the scripture says 5:45 wamanlam yahkum bima anzala Allahu faola-ikahumu alththalimoona (not quoted the full verse – please check all the refs and see the whole verse and context to verify – don’t take my word for it!) and enough verses pertaining to the groups who obey God 34:20 fareeqan mina almu/mineena and the groups who are the party of God 5:56 and 58:22 hizba Allahi and the one about Musa coming back down the mountain and his brother begging him not to seize him by his beard for not getting involved and telling the bani israel to stop worshipping the calf 20:94 khasheetu an taqoolafarraqta bayna banee isra-eela  and Musa’s own “shīʿatihi” (28:15 ) Also 37:79 – 83 is referring to Nuh, in a positive way – that peace is to be upon him and the good doers are to be rewarded, – he was of the believing slaves/servants and the others were drowned and indeed from among his shīʿatihi was Ibrahim.
Read more at quranistvoices.wordpress.com

The False Justifications for a Sunni Khilafah

The False Justifications for a Sunni Khilafah

I was astounded today when I read a response to justify the Sunni institution of the Khilafah (Caliphate):

Evidence 1

“And rule between them by that which Allah revealed to you, and do not follow their vain desires away from the truth which came to you”. [ 5:48]

Evidence 2

“..Verily the ‘Hukm’ (command, Judgment) is for none but Allah..” [12:40]

Evidence 3

“Whoever does not judge by that which Allah has revealed, they are disbelievers” [5:44]

Anyone who knows the above ayat would be sad at their miscontextualised use. Lets begin with 5/48. The author starts his quote with ‘And rule between them by that which Allah revealed to you’ . How do you apply a verse which begins with an ‘and’? Obviously you must read 5/48 in full and when you do you will see this:

And We have revealed to you,the Book in truth, confirming that which preceded it of the Scripture and as a criterion over it. So judge between them by what Allah has revealed …

As you can see, the author’s allegation about the ‘maa’ and general use is patently false. It is not general, it refers to the Quran. Nothing else is mentioned. You should write the author to withdraw such a poor use of the Quran.

As for the khilafah, it is an institiution which has no basis in the Quran. It’s not that the Quran rejects the notion of a government. Rather it rejects the ideas of classical Sharia law. A great example would be blasphemy and apostasy. The Quran simply has no provisions for the two and whatever punishment stipulated is therefore unquranic.

Read more at quranistvoices.wordpress.com

Sunday 22 May 2011

The Deceptive "Just Muslim Label" by quranists

Amplify’d from www.quranists.net

The liberation afforded to us by virtue of this label ‘Quranist’ amazes me. By declaring myself a Quranist and having materials bearing the name there is simply no confusion anymore: I am NOT an orthodox Muslim and my non-acceptance of orthodox (read: Traditional) Islam is apparent to whoever sees this name. At worst, they will see the name, ignore it but my job is still done. I have entered my disclaimer. I do NOT represent orthodox Islam. The onus is on the reader to find out what a Quranist is.

I am very surprised at the insistence of some quranists (with a small ‘q’, that is people who believe in the Quran as a sole divine source but don’t necessarily adopt the term ‘Quranist’) to use the term ‘Muslim’. They insist there is only just one Islam (theirs obviously) and that any kind of deviation from that Islam is sectarianism. I term them as Quranic Fundamentalists (QF’ists) because while they are Quranic, despite the Quran’s spirit of openness and tolerance, they do not follow suit.

Having witnessed some of their activities recently, I’m afraid I have to say that I am rather disappointed in the lack of honesty being displayed in their activities. One such group, ‘Support for New Muslims’, is run by quranists who are ordinarily very critical of hadith. However, in this particular group, they have sublimated their criticisms presumably not to scare off their ‘customers’.

I admit, their actions may actually bring the Quran to many new Muslims but at what price? These new Muslims went to their group sincerely seeking what is likely to be Traditional Islam (due to its overwhelming prevalence). By hiding the fact that they are not representatives of Traditional Islam, they are selling the product that the customer did not seek. Of course, they are selling what they believe is a better product but isn’t it simply honesty to tell the New Muslim, at the very least, that their views are not just unorthodox but also outright heretical in some circles?

Read more at www.quranists.net

Saturday 21 May 2011

Upfront and honest

Just think of it this way. After beginning to receive the Divine Message, the Prophet (SAAW) invited the Makkans to submit to Allah Almighty alone, which means, the Quran alone. This was Allah’s command. Allah did NOT tell the Prophet in the Quran to nurture the sentiments of the idolaters and merge pagan values with Allah’s Commandments. NO question about that.

Upfront and honest

I found this post on a forum:

entitled “Some of our Quran-alone speakers need to be more upfront”

“To be a Quran-only follower means to follow the authentic traditional Islam adhered to by our Prophet (SAAW), minus all later-time annexations in the form of Hadith, fatwas etc. not included in the Quran nor warranted by the Quran.
Unlike the wisdom and courage of our Prophet (SAAW), our present Quran-alone speakers aka “scholars” are working with a HIDDEN AGENDA. While their mission is to promote the Quran, their strategy is to observe silence towards the enemy of the Quran. May Allah (The Highest) grant them greater fortitude and a desire for a ‘celebrity status’ in the Hereafter rather than this fleeting earthly life.”

Of course this is one quranist’s opinion. It seems to me that the terms Quranism and Quranist not only aid effective communication, but can also prevent misunderstandings and address the issues presented above.

Read more at quranistvoices.wordpress.com

Friday 20 May 2011

Desperately Seeking: Divine Guidance

Desperately Seeking: Divine Guidance

I remember a long time ago (before my conversion to Islam) I wanted to lose weight and my belief was that I could only really effectively achieve that goal by 1. Reducing my fat and sugar intake and 2 increasing my physical activity. Essentially that’s all I had to do.

Anyone who has ever tried to do this will know that sticking at something that you know is good for you is sometimes not that easy. Sometimes we are tired or lazy. We are only human after all. What I personally found to be of benefit was reading magazine articles about nutrition, getting readers’ tips on what kinds of low-fat food items are out there on the supermarket shelves,  people’s opinions on what is tried and tested as tasty AND low calorie, suggestions to spice up the exercise routine. I read lots of magazines from different publishers, each with reader contributions – unbiased, genuine personal experiences and sharing what they found worked for them. I read personal testimonials, and saw before and after photos. I even got a training buddy so that when we made an appointment to go running together or to the gym, we actually stuck at it. Sometimes there were adverts at the back of the magazine for magic pills claiming they were THE only way to lose weight. Or special machines that were THE only way to get the perfect flat stomach. The magazine articles and reader’s contributions never claimed to be THE only way; the information was there to muse upon, be encouraged by, be tried out, tested for yourself, or rejected. The goal (lose weight) was always the number one focus.

I recently invited someone to join the Quranists Network forum and the invitation was politely declined with “Thanks for your invitation but I don’t think I can guide myself. I’ll trust God and let him be my guide.”

It was a statement that made me go into analysis mode. The reply seemed to suggest that being in a forum and trusting God were mutually exclusive. I am in online forums, but I let God guide me don’t I? I trust God don’t I? I analysed my suggestion and the reply I received. It seemed to me that my suggestion to join a forum was understood to mean an invitation to “seek Divine Guidance” from other than the Quran. Of course that was not what my invitation was. What was my invitation? To join a forum. For what purpose? I had to then analyse my own reasons for using online forums.

Read more at quranistvoices.wordpress.com

Quranists between reading and interpretaion

Amplify’d from www.quranists.net

Among Quranists, the question of reading and interpreting the Quran is a relatively subtle issue but nonetheless, very important for us to build a open and accepting association.

The question is ever present in Traditional Islam too. Traditional Muslims ask ‘who speaks for Islam’ just as we ask ‘who has the right to speak for the Quran’. The answer to this question is tied who will be answering for us on judgement day: we ourselves. If we are to answer for ourselves, then it really is our right, nay our duty to offer our opinions on Quranic interpretation.

Let’s get back to the question of reading and interpretation. This question may also be phrased as the question of objectivity and subjectivity. Is it possible to read the Quran objectively, that is, without any kind of human element involved?

Read more at www.quranists.net

Thursday 19 May 2011

Fiction - mini story



An old friend invited me to go shopping with her. We shopped til we dropped and decided to go get a Starbocks.

Friend: You go grab a table and I’ll order. What do you want?

Me: Just a drink for me please

Friend: Ok what do you want?

Me: Just a drink!

Friend: I know, I heard you the first time! I mean! What kind of drink do you want?

Me: Seriously just a drink, thanks.

Friend: Yeah but what? – Hot drink? Cold drink? Juice? Tea? Coffee? Latte? Cappuccino? Hot chocolate?

Me: Just a drink!!

Friend: (looks puzzled) Um…Ok, whatever.

Friend goes to order. I go get a table. Friend comes back with her drink and an Irish Cream Liqueur Froppuccino for me.

I tell her I can’t drink it because I don’t do dairy.

She gets annoyed at me for not saying anything.

Read more at quranistvoices.wordpress.com

Tuesday 17 May 2011

Multiple paths to Salvation

Amplify’d from www.quranists.net

by Darcus

I have recently come across some friction in regards to the use of the term Quranist as my label and Quranism as the methodology I employ to work the Deen.

So I thought the following must hold true:

Multiple paths to salvation:

[QXP] 5:16 Through this Book God guides to PATHS of Peace, those who seek His Approval. He brings them out of darkness into the light of His grace, and guides them to the straight path.

[TRANSLIT] 5:16 Yahdee bihi Allahu mani ittabaAAa ridwanahu SUBULA alssalami wayukhrijuhum mina alththulumati ila alnnoori bi-ithnihi wayahdeehim ila siratin mustaqeemin

[QXP] 14:12 “Why should we not put our trust in God? He has shown us the WAYS we follow. We shall certainly endure with uncompromising resolve whatever torment you inflict upon us. Let those who trust put their trust in God.” [Trusting in God is trusting the permanence of His laws]

[TRANSLIT] 14:12 Wama lana alla natawakkala AAala Allahi waqad hadana SUBULANA walanasbiranna AAala ma athaytumoona waAAala Allahi falyatawakkali almutawakkiloona

[QXP] 29:69 As for those who sincerely strive for Us, We surely guide them onto PATHS that lead to Us. (New channels keep opening for them leading them out of the spider’s web onto the straight path.) God is with

the benefactors of Humanity. [Muhsineen = Benefactors of humanity]

[TRANSLIT] 29:69 Waallatheena jahadoo feena lanahdiyannahum SUBULANA wa-inna Allaha lamaAAa almuhsineena

The word SUBUL is the plural form of SABIL as in ‘fi SABIL Allah’ literally ‘in the way of Allah/in the cause of Allah’

From these verse it can be deduced that:

1. Allah guides those who seek His Approval

2. There are MANY paths/ways to ‘alssalami’ peace/salvation…translate according to context.

3. If there are MANY paths, whats wrong with those paths having different names?

Please remember THIS verse:

[QXP] 2:112 Nay, WHOEVER submits his whole being to God,

and he is a doer of good to humanity,

his reward is with his Lord.

Then, no fear shall come upon them nor shall they grieve.

These type of debates that you set up and the way you antagonise people and call their beliefs into question sort of falls into line with the following:

2:113 Also,

the Jews assert that the Christians have no basis, and

the Christians assert that the Jews have no basis. Yet,

both groups read the scripture!

Such is the behavior of those who have no knowledge (or scripture).

God will judge between them on the Day of Resurrection concerning that wherein they differ.

[Qaul = Utterance = Thought = Assertion = Tenet = Attitude = Expression. Mankind holding divergent views will acknowledge the Divine truth in this world as well. 9:33-34, 11:118-119, 41:53, 48:28, 61:9]

Let’s look at this in a slightly different way:

[QXP] 5:48 (O Messenger!) We have sent to you this Divine writ, setting forth the truth.

It confirms the remaining truth in the earlier scriptures since it is a watcher over them.

So, judge between them by what God has revealed, and

do not follow their desires diverging from the truth that has come to you.



But He decided to let you test yourselves by what (potentials) He has granted you.

So, outdo one another in doing good to the society. To God you will all return, and He will then make you understand wherein you differed.

[TRANSLIT] 5:48 Waanzalna ilayka alkitaba bialhaqqi musaddiqan lima bayna yadayhi mina alkitabi wamuhayminan AAalayhi faohkum baynahum bima anzala Allahu wala tattabiAA ahwaahum AAamma jaaka mina alhaqqi likullin jaAAalna minkum shirAAatan WAMINHAJAN walaw shaa Allahu lajaAAalakum ommatan wahidatan walakin liyabluwakum feema atakum faistabiqoo alkhayrati ila Allahi marjiAAukum jameeAAan fayunabbi-okum bima kuntum feehi takhtalifoona

The word you are looking for is MINHAJAN in the arabic. This can be roughly translated as “a well defined way, manifest, plainly defined, apparent and open road”. This word only has one occurence in the Quran. It says that Allah COULD HAVE made us all one community, but he didn’t. See how there can be many well-defined ways, so that we can test ourselves and so outdo one another in doing good Good.

The following verse is self-explanatory:

[QXP] 2:148 (Mere rituals carry no importance even though people pursue their self-appointed interests.) Each one has a goal toward which he turns.

Then strive together toward all that is good.

Whatever stand you take, God will bring you all together.

Indeed, God is Able to do all things.

So, to summarise:
Read more at www.quranists.net

Monday 16 May 2011

Quran Alone-ism and Quranism

“Quran Alone-ism” and Quranism

“Quran Alone-ism” and Quranism

I saw the cumbersome term “Quran-Alone-ism” used the other day, followed by “(for lack of a better term)”.

When I need to used the term “Quran Alone-ism” or “Quran Alone-ness”, I just use the term Quranism. It is essentially the same thing.

Quranism is the belief that the Quran is the sole source of Divine Guidance. Quranists are muslims who follow Quranism.

I pondered though, due to my over-active, over-analytical mind-set, whether there is a difference between being a Quran Alone muslim and a Quranist muslim.

The term “Quran Alone” can be taken to varying degrees of pedantry.

Red Carpet example

If you take it to mean purely Quran Alone then what you will have is a belief system where ALL outside sources of information are rejected and taken to be untrue. For example if I tell you my carpet is red but you do not find it stated specifically in the Quran, then this could be rejected as untrue according to the belief that the only true information comes directly from the Quran.

Now of course this is a ridiculous example of taking the meaning of words to their extreme and absolute limit.

The following are some of the different types of Quran Alone-ness (Quranism)

Read more at quranistvoices.wordpress.com

Catching up on responses

Anon: "I'm glad to see that you decided to create your own group because I refuse to have people that 100% reject hadith to be lecturing and teaching new muslims in my group and disrespecting the fact that almost all members were not appreciative of it. However, I will not join your group and preach that you are wrong, and mislead others as you and bento box did to everyone in my group. You never provide any links to sources other than a "Quranist" Muslim website and that is not an effective way to teach new Muslims. Subhanallah. (I'm sure you will delete this comment because it is against your wishes just like you and bento did with me, yet I didn't delete your comments, I left them to show the rest of the group and allow the rest of the group to comment on it all.) If you are true to your words about criticisms and people not conforming to your "SECT" as you stated to me, you will leave my post as I left yours and Bento box's. The shoe is on the other foot now.....let see if you like the negative criticisms posted to you.

Bento Box Asfora: I am very open to constructive criticism. I will take your word for it that my posts are still on there, thank you for that. I can't check because I have been removed from the group so cannot see anything now! Can you re-add me please?

Anon: "oh, and at Bento box....."QURANIST" is a sect whether you want to call it one or not. You can twist it all you want, but when you make yourself identifiable as a hadith rejector, you have separated yourself....therefore you ARE a sect, like it or not."

Bento Box Asfora: Here are some articles you might find to be of interest:

Anon "everyone was welcome in my group as well, however, what gets taught has to follow a particular line of Islam. when you are trying to teach new muslims, you kinda have to pick a path of what is taught and shared (sunni teachings, or shia teachings, or sufi teachings, or whatever...cause you can't mix them)......cause otherwise you will have shia promoting Muta' marriage, the Sunni disgusted by it, both calling the others kafirs, and sufis trying to push their stuff and no one will be in the group by the end of the day no one will find the group beneficial or worth supporting from any sect if it is not primarily following one path....just wait and see....at some point, you will have to make a decision about what gets posted and not, even when it comes to the prayers....the sunni and shia don't pray the same, and so many other differences, so how can you support a new muslim in an environment where all the various sects are trying to push their teachings? all it will do is confuse the hell out of reverts and they will leave islam when they see so much conflict and disunity, and innovations. I promise it is not something that is beneficial to any new muslim, whether that new muslim is a shia, a sunni, sufi, or whatever, they will find it not benefiting and find people giving others "warnings" about your group to stay away...who wants that?.....you will have to one day pick a path."

Bento Box Asfora: The Qur'an unites us all, alhamdulillah. Quranism is an umbrella term that includes all approaches to islam from varying understandings, beliefs and interpretations where the Quran is believed to be the sole authority. Quranism is quite the opposite of a sect due to its inclusivity of all approaches to quranic islam and has no set commands of belief or requirements, no leader or authority-head and does not excommunicate anyone who disagrees or has a difference of opinion. Quranism does not profess to be the only way to salvation. Quranism, by its nature of this universal inclusivity does include by definition, in principle, even those who demonstrate sectarian attitudes with claims that their view is the only true belief, even though most Quranists do not endorse such views and even though the ones demonstrating the sectarian attitude do not generally accept the terms Quranist or Quranism. For more information about Quranists, please visit http://Quranists.net

Anon: "about rejecting hadith 100%....My comments are actually more directed to Bento than anyone else on that, and the fact that you support eerything she states means there is some connection there. However, I've never heard of any 'Sunnis' that hold hadith as "holy" or anything like that. They are the "sunnah", and as we know, sunnah is not obligatory, but optional and suggested, but Bento, and you both were rejecting basically every hadith and discrediting ALL hadith everytime the word hadith was mentioned, and Bento can't seem to state one sentence about any topic that is not promoting people to be Quranist Muslim and without providing a link to a Quranist website as if it is the only website that exists out there."

Bento Box Asfora: Please see this link about Hadith Rejection. I never claimed to "reject hadiths 100%" nor did I incite anyone else to do that. I do have a copy of the thread and what I found, looking back, is that I either posted Quran verses or links to published articles, indeed from a Quranist website. The name of the website is quranists.net which has lots of information dispelling the misconceptions about Quranists and Quranism. This link will hopefully clear up any misunderstandings. Quranist response to the term Hadith Rejector: http://www.quranists.net/2011/05/11/the-term-hadith-rejector/

Anon: "that is why i stated in my group that if you don't agree (because you are a shia or a sufi, or whatever) with what the admins post which is primarily mainstream sunni teachings, to overlook it and just benefit from the rest of the things and support, but I won't tolerate those of those other sects 'teaching' their material that is against mainstream sunni islam in my group.....anyone would do that regardless of what path they follow.....right? so, people were welcome, but they can't just start teaching and insulting others and whathaveyou with their teachings. understand?"

Bento Box Asfora : Just a sincere suggestion - maybe you could rename your group to "Sunni Revert Support". That might be more clear/honest/upfront so as not to unintentionally deceive/confuse anyone.

Anon: "No one is stating to not teach Quran by any means, but why does the shahada include the blessings on the prophet PBUH if we are not supposed to follow him, as he was guided by Allah? We are supposed to follow the teachings of jesus, and moses, etc PBUT too, but to not teach their life and follow their practice (they were examples for us to follow and learn from as our teachers) is like the blind leading the blind. the prophet was sent not only to reveal the revelations but to TEACH them as stated in the quran, so, if Allah didn't want us to follow his example, then he would have just had the Quran drop from the sky, cause that would be the ultimate miracle wouldn't it not?"

Bento Box Asfora: Not sure exactly what you mean by "the shahada includes the blessings on the prophet". Do you have a Quran reference for it? By the way, you might be interested to see this article entitled "Prophetic examples from the Quran": http://www.quranists.net/2011/04/29/prophetic-examples-from-the-quran/

Anon: "so, how would you handle in your group when people are teaching the sunnah (hadiths) ? are you just going to delete all their posts and state that only quran is allowed?"

Bento Box Asfora: Good question. I personally hope most people will be intelligent enough to be able to sort the wheat from the chaff. Allah guides who He wills. I personally feel that trying to protect the new "baby" reverts from every piece of information that does not agree with one's own beliefs is a cumbersome task for anyone, could be seen to be slightly manipulative or controlling. I think the organistation and administration of your group is really commendable though. I see you put a lot of work into it to keeping it neat and organised and everything documented, and keeping the unwanted ones out. I would like to be re-added to your group so I can continue to learn from your leadership and organisation skills if I may?

Anon : "it all sounds very easily in the hypothetical discussions of how you manage the group, but when it comes down to it, you will be ready to pull your hair out over the bickering that will take place. Every single posting will have arguments, people getting offended, insulted, and people will leave the group. Bento's remarks in JUST ONE THREAD caused over 10 people to leave the group........not because they agreed with her, but because they refuse to be in a group that had people disrespecting others and basically stating that all they believe is false because she was trying to convince everyone that hadith should be completely rejected and they didn't want to remain in the group because they felt it was misleading others and didn't want to be part of it. so, i promise you will face this if you allow ALL sects to post their teachings. people from ALL sects will leave, and the group would ONLY be a place for arguments and debates between those that are not really new muslims, but more advanced or born raised muslim...so, there goes the converts, and what you would have left is a bunch of people with big egos in constant debates."

Bento Box Asfora: No offence, and apologies if you think that the Quran verses I posted made people leave your group. Maybe they left because they found out the truth - that your group is teaching the Sunni path. Nothing wrong with that as there are many paths in islam, may Allah reward all the doers of good, inshaaAllah. I just think it would be better to be honest about it and upfront. I stated in my introduction to your group that I am a Quranist. Just trying to be honest so as not to deceive anyone. I am a muslim and I believe that Allah's words in the Quran are the sole authority. You said "you made the intentional statement that you were a "Quranist Muslim" and  if you didnt' want anyone to mention anything about it, maybe you should not have mentioned that, because you know yourself that most people do not agree to it" I don't fear what other people think of my beliefs, I fear only Allah, inshaaAllah and was just trying to be honest. But I respect your right to believe that it is acceptable and noble to teach new reverts Sunni Islam. Maybe you could make it clear on the group description to avoid confusion? I agree about the ego thing and agree we should remain humble and share what we have without claiming to have 100% the correct information as only Allah knows best.

Anon: "well, my group and no one in it has ever even suggested to commit violence or anything like that against other sects, etc......but it is about the educational materials shared in a group. People giving hadith etc about Witr prayer, and about jinn, etc is not anything to do with dividing people, etc....but these two threads in my group (the one on witr which caused and argument and insults between sufis and others, and the thread that bento and you were in on jinn was between quranists rejecting all hadith and the rest of the members).....they are simple topics, not that complex, but yet 10 people left the group over it.....as if they were discussing who are considered kafirs, or Muta' marriages, or grave worshiping, (and/or any other controversial topics between the sects)."

Bento Box Asfora: I didn't see any insults - I think I had been removed from the group before I was able to see the rest of that thread, maybe. People were sharing information with each other. Let's agree to disagree. Peace be upon you, I know your intentions are good. Salaam Aleykum

Saturday 14 May 2011

Was I short-changed?

Was I short-changed?

A fictional tale.

After shopping around for a long time, I decided to buy a top of the range BRAND NAME  printer.

The salesperson in the store told me it would be everything I needed as it was a complete office system for printing the best photos, scanning, faxing to make life easier, more peaceful and stress free.

Excited, I got my BRAND NAME printer home. I had no idea what to do with it.

I phoned the store where I bought it from and they told me that to be able to understand what to do with it and get it working I must buy:

- software installation CD and drivers

- a USB cable

- ink cartridges

- 6 instruction and advice books

And they said I needed to register for a special workshop to show me how to use it. They told me the printer I had chosen was so technologically advanced and complicated that it is impossible to be able to just buy one and expect to be able to understand how to use it without help from the professionals.

They referred me to their OWN 3rd PARTY BRAND of the parts and accessories they told me were missing, which were non-manufacturer approved. I bought them and:

  • The USB cable was from a different country and I had to buy a separate adapter to get it to fit.

  • Of the 4 ink cartridges, 1 seemed to fit ok but the other 3 did not.

  • The software was not compatible with my Operating System

  • I went to the professionals workshop and they tried to convince me that learning to use the printer would take a lot of time, many years, maybe even a whole lifetime to be able to understand how to use it, and tried to convince me that printing, scanning and faxing were not that important anyway. They told me the manufacturer had explained everything in the 3rd Party software, and warned me of the dangers of using anyone else’s 3rd party hardware or software.

  • And then I got a virus from their online support website.

Afterwards I found out that the manufacturer had provided a BRAND NAME USB cable and a BRAND NAME software installation CD and BRAND NAME ink cartridges all in the original box, all fully guaranteed with a lifetime quality assurance warranty. I also found simple and clear instructions on how to get it up and running, without needing to attend the professionals workshop.

Moral of the story – Always read the instruction manual.

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Wednesday 11 May 2011

The Promise of the Ibada Study

The Promise of the Ibada Study

Whenever I see in the Concordance of the Quran an entry more than a page long, I get scared off. Hence my extreme feet-dragging about concepts like rabb, ilm and ayah…and of course ibadah. However, a few days ago I looked at OpenBurhan for a verse with the word ‘a3budoo’ and realised that the study of ibadah yields some very interesting results. Check this out:

يَا أَيُّهَا الَّذِينَ آمَنُوا كُلُوا مِنْ طَيِّبَاتِ مَا رَزَقْنَاكُمْ وَاشْكُرُوا لِلَّهِ إِنْ كُنْتُمْ إِيَّاهُ تَعْبُدُونَ

O you who believe, eat from the good things we provided for you, and be thankful to GOD, if you do worship Him alone (2/172)
iyyahu ta3bduoon (if you worship him alone) shows that a level of tawheed which is strange for a command about consumption! Ibada is definitely something more than I previously thought…
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The term “Hadith Rejector”

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The term “Hadith Rejector”

What does it mean to “reject”?

[v. ri-jekt; n. ree-jekt] –verb (used with object)

1. to refuse to have, take, recognize, etc.: to reject the offer of a better job.

2. to refuse to grant (a request, demand, etc.).

3. to refuse to accept (someone or something); rebuff: The other children rejected him. The publisher rejected the author’s latest novel.

What does it mean to “Reject Hadith” or to be labelled as a “Hadith Rejector”?

Quranists are often labelled as “Rejectors of Hadith”. It has a derogatory connotation that to “Reject Hadith” is to be a “kafir” or a non-believer in God’s commands and to be non-supportive of the Messenger of God. Calling someone a “Hadith Rejector” seems to imply that they are somehow “disobedient” to the Messenger and to God. Sadly, quite often, the term “Hadith Rejector” is used as a synonym for non-muslim.

This piece will hopefully show InshaaAllah why the terms “Hadith Rejection” and “Hadith Rejector” need to be clarified. The terms do not necessarily have to imply negative connotations. It is however important to clarify what it is that Quranists DO reject.

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Why do Quranists have different views on Salat?

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Question: Why do Quranists have different views on Salat?

Question: I have been browsing the internet for Quranist websites and their views on salat (commonly understood to be the Muslim ritual prayer) is very worrying? Why do you modify the Salat which the Muslims agree on and why do some of you reject it totally?

The question of Salat is usually the first one asked by other Muslims to Quranists upon hearing that we reject Islamic Traditions. How else can we learn to pray, they ask?

Because Quranism

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Tuesday 10 May 2011

Why does it say, “and obey His messenger”?

Kashif Ahmed Shahzada’s, The Quran’s Sole Authority, is the most comprehensive refutation of the traditionalist claim that hadith and sunnah are a requirement for islam. The work proves that the quran is the only source of divine guidance and that the messenger was bound by the message.

8/20 O you who believe! Obey Allah and His messenger and do not turn back from him while you hear.

As pointed out by Kashif Shahzada, the singular pronoun ‘him’ instead of the plural ‘us’ indicates that the obedience is one and the same. The messenger was not commanding anything different to what Allah was commanding. This is confirmed by:

4/80 Whoever obeys the messenger, he indeed obeys Allah, and whoever turns back, so We have not sent you as a keeper over them.

However, a remainder of this equation is often picked up on by opponents of the quranist position: why is the messenger mentioned at all? It is a valid question, given the argument is that obeying Allah and obeying His messenger are in fact one and the same. Is not the inclusion of the messenger then a redundant detail?

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Who are the real sectarians

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Who are the Real Sectarians?

The Quranists, being at the beginning of our modern emergence, face the great opposition from Quranic Fundamentalists (QFists for short) about the very term. Many QFists (people who believe in the Quran as the sole source of islam yet oppose the term ‘Quranist’) believe we should only use the term ‘Muslim’. They accuse Quranists of being sectarians by the very act of taking the name!

Who is a sectarian? A sectarian is one who builds walls around themselves. They consider themselves to be the exclusive owners of salvation. The chosen ones of Allah. Some Sunnis and Shia have this view of themselves where they think that out of the ’73 sects’ (this is from a hadith), they belong to the the one which is saved.

QFists who have this view tend to call themselves ‘Muslim’ and attack those who call themselves ‘Quranists’. It is difficult to tell if they realise that by taking on this name with no qualifier beyond the word ‘Muslim’, they are making a serious insinuation. That other Muslims are not Muslims at all.

How does the Quran view this interpretation? The Quran

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Quranism FAQs #1

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Question: Quranism Opposed by Friends and Family?

by admin

Question: I am very interested in Quranism but I find that my family and friends oppose Quranism and say really bad things about it. What should I do?

Answer: Family and friends

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Monday 9 May 2011

Paradise and Hell

Paradise and Hell

May 9, 2011 by Asfora Leave a Comment (Edit)



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A friend of mine said something disturbing to me today. She said she knows she is going to have to spend some time in hell and have her hair burnt off because she doesn’t wear the headscarf, and sometimes she wears short sleeves.

I voiced my concerns that I didn’t think that this is mentioned in the Quran, but she went on to say that after this time in hell for the burning of the hair, then people can go to Paradise.

It was a concept I’d not come across before. I thought Hell and Paradise were “either / or” – either you go to one or the other for eternity. I will have to look up some references to see if there is any truth to this idea that we could spend some time in one before being sent to the other (for whatever reason – headscarf / short sleeves aside), and whether it works both ways. Eg could you go to Paradise for a brief spell and then be sent to Hell for the rest of the time.

Please feel welcome to comment or discuss on the Qnet forum

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